Someone is drinking the cool aid.

>Where does that leave Europe?

Where does it leave US without allies?

Allies? Doesn't look like it.

>if we end up in another war.

If you end up in another war.. the coming month? Do you think Trump has had enough? Ans that the coming presidents wont start one?

>Iran has been buying and building all of this military infrastructure at the expense of living conditions for its people just for this very attack,

And how much is US spending?

>just for this very attack, only to have almost everything obliterated.

The spending was apparently justified.

Well, what should people infer from Trump either pleading og trying to threaten for help every other day?

Wait, are you talking about the US government now?

Its equally misleading to pretend like the bases have just a couple small benefits for the US. Come on, please. You dont believe it either. Ah yes, the post world war doctrine has been so that the us can have more flexibility. Sure thing. What a waste it has been for European Nations to have sacrificed lives for Americas wars the last decades.

I agree with you, it is misleading. But there are two sides who are both being misleading - that's all I'm calling out here.

> What a waste it has been for European Nations to have sacrificed lives for Americas wars the last decades.

I personally don't support any comment suggesting that Europe hasn't at times been there for us in these conflicts or that their sacrifices weren't meaningful. But that's only part of the equation. We're in a different world from where we were in 2001 and things change and so you can't just hang your hat on this one thing, else we (Americans) get to hang our hat on any time period we want to as well where Americans sacrificed for Europe.

The whole "we did this then" is driving a lot of folks into lunacy, but there does seem to be material differences and that is concerning if you believe in these alliance systems which I generally do.

You have folks on this website who would tell you the US is actively working with Russia against Ukraine, and then in the same breath defend Iran from the US blowing up drone factories that Iran is using to manufacture drones for Russia to use to go murder Ukrainians! Kind of hard to have a conversation or an alliance if a population is being convinced of absolutely crazy things like this.

>What I think would really happen, is the rest of the world would suffer and run out of energy. Not the US.

Then why is it the US that is crying about opening the Strait? You know there are oil produsers outside of the US?

"Bored", is that what you call thousands killed, a massive national debt and a political minefield?

This is interesting. Even though its many years ago most of Europe have a big open wound from WWII. That might be a missing ingredient for the american people to be less trigger happy when it comes to bombing other countries. The act of bombing a school full of children would have turned everything on its head in my country.

Your "big open wound" is my country's stepping into what was still mostly an elective war, saving the day, coming out as the head of a global economic empire, and being lauded for all of it - including well after the war itself for being the alternative to the more direct-subjugation-based empire of the USSR.

I'm not saying this to brag or something, but to drive home how radically different the perspectives are. Even our stories that are fundamentally tragedies (eg Saving Private Ryan) are still tales of distant heroic sacrifice, rather than the nihilistic smothering of helpless humans that war actually is. And to that above-it-all entitlement, we've mixed a cocktail of religious fundamentalism to help with the rationalization.

Vietnam was seemingly the only time since that there has been serious society-wide anti-war sentiment, and that's because people were being forcibly conscripted against their individual will. They fixed that by (effectively) removing the draft, while the economic treadmill was turned up such that more people "volunteered".

If thats important its counter intuitive to show that agreements about not getting any nuklear arms is worth nothing, and wont stop you getting invaded.